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“I have no plans on stopping,” WWE Hall of Famer Paul Heyman said of retiring from the business. “I have all plans on growing and understanding this role and interaction with the audience better — I really do believe I'm just figuring it out now.”
Despite being in the business for over four decades, Heyman is still evolving. Whenever his story with Tribal Chief Roman Reigns ends, he will still only be getting started.
Upon bringing up the idea of retirement, Heyman quickly exclaimed, “I hope it's no time soon — are they trying to cast me off?” Of course, WWE fans love Heyman, especially upon his return on SmackDown.
The Wiseman is only looking ahead. He wants to look back proudly on his work six months from now. He even cited the great ECW legend, Rob Van Dam, saying, “Judge it from your own perspective, but this is my art.”
Why calling on CM Punk makes sense
I got to speak with Heyman one day after his shocking SmackDown return, which made him feel “like I had come home.” He introduced CM Punk, his former meal ticket during his 434-day WWE Championship reign, as the fifth member of the OG Bloodline for Survivor Series: WarGames.
While having Punk, instead of someone like Brock Lesnar, fill the final slot of the OG Bloodline's team may have seemed random, the seeds were there.
“It goes all the way back to the Hall of Fame, doesn't it?” Heyman asked. “Who introduced me to the Hall of Fame? Roman Reigns. No one else should have introduced me other than Roman Reigns. Our legacies are tied together forever, and my God am I blessed and fortunate for that.
“And then in the front row were my kids, and who was sitting with my kids? My best friend, CM Punk, and I spelled that out for the audience that was there. So when the proverbial s**t hits the fan, and I am Shield Bombed through a table in Madison Square Garden by a rogue Bloodline led by a traitor like Solo [Sikoa], to whom would I turn to save the day when it's a five-on-four situation and there's no one that will bail [out] the OG Bloodline?” he continued.
Even after the Hall of Fame ceremony, Heyman begged Punk to take him with him to save him from the Sikoa-led Bloodline. Reigns went on a long hiatus after WrestleMania XL, leaving the Wiseman to keep it together.
The answer was right there
So, Punk was always the answer. Leaving the answer in plain sight is something that the WWE creatives love to do with the Bloodline.
“What we always like to do in the Bloodline, and this is a constant theme for the past four years, [is have] the answer right there, [so] that in hindsight, it is so obvious that we have been telling you the answer for the past six-to-ten months.”
The Bloodline has become such an integral part of WWE programming. They have been the focal point of the company for over four years. And even then, it sounds like they are still just getting started.
Why SmackDown was the perfect spot for Paul Heyman's WWE return
Ever since Heyman was written off TV, his return to WWE was highly anticipated. The first logical place would have been at SummerSlam when Reigns returned. The Wiseman could have been side-by-side with his Tribal Chief.
But that did not happen. He also did not return with Jimmy Uso when he came back. Heyman didn't even play a role in the recruitment of Jey Uso.
While the penultimate episode of SmackDown before WWE's Survivor Series: WarGames PLE may have been underwhelming, it all made sense to Paul Heyman. To him, the date did not matter as much as moving the Bloodline story forward.
“You're always looking for the optimum time to not only pay something off but move it forward,” he explained. “This is one of those circumstances where it is more important to move the story forward than to pay something off because the payoff is still coming down the road to move the story forward.
“Could we have done this the night before Survivor Series? Yeah, but look at the momentum we have now coming out of this already, and we still have seven more days to promote Survivor Series. Could we have done this two weeks ago? Yeah, but then it wouldn't have the immediacy and the urgency going into Survivor Series. So in looking at a calendar and looking at how stories play out and looking at how to propel stories moving forward, this [was] the optimum date,” he added.
The subtle wardrobe change
Some fans noticed that Heyman was sporting a red shirt with his black suit. It looked similar to what Sikoa wore when he started taking over the Bloodline. Could that mean he was going to turn on Reigns and join the new Bloodline?
“Bloodline colors out in front in a neon-level display, wearing my love for the Bloodline literally on my sleeve,” Heyman quickly explained.
Working with Roman Reigns during the 1,300-day title reign
Another thing spending time with Heyman reveals is that Reigns is not his meal ticket. He repeatedly expressed his gratitude for Reigns, praising the Tribal Chief, and comparing his love to one of a significant other.
“You know, if you're really blessed in life, you get to be around people whose presence inspires you as much as it can define you,” he said. “But that inspires you to be better tomorrow than you are today and better two days from now than you are tomorrow. If you spend your life with a significant other and you love them more today than you did yesterday, and you will love them more tomorrow than you do today, then you're a blessed person.”
Being paired with Reigns is like winning the lottery, he said. So, in turn, he cannot specify one moment that stands above the rest during their partnership.
“If I were to tell you my favorite moment with Roman Reigns happened on November 22, or August 21, or September 23, I'm discounting how I feel today,” he explained.
What will he do now that Reigns isn't champion?
Now that Reigns is no longer Undisputed WWE Champion, Paul Heyman knows it will be weird the first time he enters the arena with him. For over 1,300 days, he was holding at least one championship belt (and as many as three at one point). Now, he has no gold to carry.
“It's going to be different, and that is the fascinating part of how the Wiseman will handle that,” Heyman conceded. “What we got out of WrestleMania [XL] was the Wiseman desperately trying to hold together an assignment he was tasked with by his Tribal Chief, not knowing that the assignment was doomed from the beginning because Solo [Sikoa] saw it as the opportunity to make his own move.
“You saw a desperate, terrified, [and] justifiably paranoid Wiseman [who was] lost without his Tribal Chief, because the goal kept shifting because Solo kept rigging the game,” he continued. “We're on a different path — how does the Wiseman handle a title-less Tribal Chief?”
He then points out that he has managed 80% of WWE's longest-title holders since 2012. This figure comes from the likes of CM Punk's 434-day reign as WWE Champion, Brock Lesnar's 504-day Universal Championship reign, and, of course, Reigns' 1,316-day Undisputed WWE Championship run.
One final question Heyman proposes in the aftermath of Reigns losing his title: “How does the Wiseman now present himself not only as the GOAT but as the top of the industry in this position if he has no gold to hold?”
Did the length of the title reign matter to Reigns and Heyman?
While Reigns did not top Hulk Hogan's 1,474-day reign or Bruno Sammartino's 2,803-day reign during his Undisputed WWE Championship run, it doesn't matter, according to Heyman.
“No,” he quickly replied in regards to how much the number of days in the title reign matters. “The number matters in terms of how relevant it is to the days of the lives that are affected [in] the audience. In today's environment, when someone can go 1,315 days, that number is very relevant, but the number above on the record list is not.”
Reigns chasing Hogan or Sammartino was “never the story,” as Heyman explained. It was about an underdog toppling the villain on the throne.
Nothing better proves Paul Heyman's point than Cody Rhodes' story with the Undisputed WWE Championship. He spent two years chasing Reigns and the Undisputed WWE Championship. Even the World Heavyweight Championship wouldn't satisfy his appetite for a world championship.
Letting the Wiseman's grey hairs show
Whenever Reigns wasn't around, Heyman subtly changed his appearance. He is committed to the role of the Wiseman more than any of his previous characters. Sometimes, his hair would grey, and his eyes would become bloodshot during Reigns' extended absences.
Heyman initially brushed it off, saying he has to “dress to impress” when the Tribal Chief was around. He compared it to being around your boss and wanting to look presentable until casual Friday when the boss is out. However, when the Tribal Chief was not around, Heyman would let the “pressure” show.
Paul Heyman's reaction to the WWE universe saying his introduction
When Heyman returned on SmackDown, the crowd said his signature introduction and basically took it from him as he was speaking. This was not the first time this had happened — earlier this year in Lyon, France, the crowd similarly stole his thunder, which appeared to take him by surprise.
But these were not the first instances of this happening. Heyman recalls the first WWE show in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, when he was still with Lesnar. He was unsure about doing his signature introduction for the Beast Incarnate, wondering if they would be okay identifying with the Beast Incarnate.
After asking Lesnar about skipping the introduction, he replied, “Only one way to find out.” Luckily, it worked, and it was “surreal” for him.
The Lyon crowd made Paul Heyman want WWE to open a developmental territory there and to do more TV tapings from the city. He did note that they are building a stadium across the street from LDLC Arena and asked the higher-ups at TKO to book a show there.
The WWE's “Beast Incarnate” Brock Lesnar
During Reigns' Undisputed WWE Championship run, one of his top feuds was with Lesnar. Granted, the two have a storied history, as they are like this generation's John Cena vs. Randy Orton.
This time around, Paul Heyman was by Reigns' side. Looking at the Beast Incarnate from across the ring is “terrifying.” He recalled going to the ring first, and once Lesnar's music hit, he “literally fills your eyesight” from the entrance ramp.
“He fills the frame of your sphere of vision and you just sit there and say. ‘Oh, my God, what species is that?' He's like nothing else I have ever experienced.
“And it's funny because for 20 years, I did that walk down the aisle with him. I never knew what it was like to be in the ring watching it come at you. You just sit there and start thinking, I hope the insurance is paid up for my kids,” he continued.
During Lesnar's babyface run, he showed a different side of him. He would show up to RAW and SmackDown wearing jeans and cowboy boots and even cut promos. Even Heyman seemed surprised at the level of charisma he had.
Will Lesnar ever return to WWE?
Currently, Lesnar is on hiatus from WWE. He has not been seen since the 2023 SummerSlam PLE when he took on Cody Rhodes. It may be due to him potentially being linked to the Janel Grant-Vince McMahon lawsuit.
Still, you can never say never. Recently, WWE has been comfortable mentioning his name on TV, perhaps setting up a surprise return.
Heyman no longer manages him, and he is not sure if we will ever see Lesnar again. One thing he made clear is that Lesnar's return is dependent on his desire to be in the spotlight. There is a chance that WWE will never see him again, and that would be his choice.
“I don't have that answer because Brock Lesnar is not in the public eye, which affords him a level of privacy that I would never violate,” Heyman said. “So, if Brock Lesnar is of the desire to ever be in the public eye again, he'll let you know when the time is right. He's earned the right to that privacy.
“Brock Lesnar's a private man, a private Beast. Should he wish to be in the public eye, he will be, and should he wish never to be seen again, you've seen the last of Brock Lesnar,” he added.
On a sweet note, Heyman praised Lesnar: “As much as Brock Lesnar will begrudgingly credit me for teaching him, I learned just as much about business and life from Brock.”
NXT's return to the 2300 Arena in Philadelphia
Before Lesnar and Reigns, Heyman was a leading force behind Extreme Championship Wrestling (ECW). In its heyday, ECW held several events at the 2300 arena in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.
WWE recently returned to the venue, bringing NXT there for a special episode in November 2024. However, Heyman was not a part of it. Granted, the WWE Hall of Famer was still off of TV at the time, so not appearing on screen avoided any awkward plot holes.
“There was no need for me to be there,” he confessed. “Because I had been off television for so long, my presence was only going to be a distraction from the young stars that deserve the spotlight.
“They didn't need me, so why waste it?” Heyman added.
He wasn't even there backstage to see the show from behind the scenes. Heyman did not want to take away from the NXT roster, which he said is the “deepest, most passionate, most charismatic, [and] most talented” they have had.
What's next for Paul Heyman?
Still, Heyman feels that he is just hitting his prime. He is looking towards the future and will talk about legacy when the time is right. For now, he will continue honing his craft.
“I would love to have this conversation 20 years from now, as I'm just hitting my prime,” he said. “I have the indescribably wonderful opportunity to apply my trade in this perverse performance art, known as World Wrestling Entertainment, and the interaction with a live audience, let alone a global audience on a consistent basis, is an inspiration to become a better writer, producer, former director at all times.”
Someday, Paul Heyman will retire from WWE. Luckily, that won't be anytime soon. His impact will be felt in NXT, WWE's main roster, and in other promotions, once he hangs up the suit and tie.
